August 20th, 2013 at 3:16 am by under Bill's Blog, Weather

Jack Martin - flower and butterfly   This is another great pic. from Jack Martin.  I wonder if the high temperature today will be 84?  The high temperature has gone up one degree per day each of the last several days in G.R.  The high was 80 on Fri., 81 on Sat., 82 on Sun. and 83 on Mon.  The average wind for the past four days (all 24 hours)  has been 3.0 mph.  GRR has recorded 98% sunshine during that period.  The last time we made 85 was 7/22, almost a full month ago.   We desperately need rain.  Sparta has had less than 1/4″ of rain this month so far.  The models all have light rainfall amounts for Thurs. AM (0.13″ for G.R. on the Euro., 0.18″ on the NAM and 0.10″ on the GFS (16-day plot).    26.6″ of rain has been reported at Sangley Point in the Philippines since Saturday.  Lightning was visible to the SW of San Francisco overnight.  1.15″ of rain fell in just 18min in North Charleston, SC  and nearly 2″ of rain in an hour caused some local flooding in Tallahassee Florida.

Something you don’t see every day…cloud-ground lightning at the San Francisco Giants MLB game.  Also, a 37-year old Twinkie.

199 Responses to “Tuesday”

  1. kevin. w says:

    I think when the rains come it will really rain quite a bit. By looking at the some of the longer range models showing the trough developing around Labor day weekend with cool air poised to make a come back and the heat just to our southeast pumping up the moisture from the gulf we could have a set up of some heavy storms and quite a bit of rain. Will see how this set up unfolds once we get into next week and look at how the jet stream sets up. So enjoy the last part of summer…I just think its going to get cooler and wetter….Hey Rocky :)

    1. Swatz_Zoo(Cedar Springs) says:

      We are enjoying the last few days of summer today and going to Michigan Adventure, oddly this will probably be the 1st time in a few years that we’ve gone without ending up running for cover because of a pop up severe storm.

  2. Travis (Oakland County) says:

    Wood now showing at least 3 days in the 90′s. Looks like Rocky’s predictions fail again. Not a big surprise.

    One GFS model printing 100 degrees on September 4th for parts of the upper midwest.

    Not seeing any cold temps for at least a month.

    1. Mark (East Lansing) says:

      Mother Nature is merely making up for the past month.

      1. Travis (Oakland County) says:

        Looks like all three SE Michigan locations are all but guaranteed another warmer than average summer… after the warmest 3 year summer stretch on record.

        1. DF (SE Mich) says:

          Wrong again… Your home town of Flint’s hottest 3 year stretch of summers was 1933,1934,1935!… by FAR. Go ahead and add 1936 in there too for the hottest four year stretch. ;)

          …and Saginaw’s was 1931, 1932, 1933… by FAR!

          Darn actual data., nice try though.

        2. Travis (Oakland County) says:

          Not wrong. I think NWS Detroit was simply talking about Detroit when I read that in one of their reports a little while ago.

          You’re not as nice as you used to be either, DF.

        3. yooper4021 says:

          You sure do duck-and-dodge and bob-and-weave with the best of them. You should run for office.

        4. Travis (Oakland County) says:

          You cold weather guys are sure upset this morning. Glad to see the whole gang is here.

        5. DF (SE Mich) says:

          I apologize. It is just frustrating that we used to have an actual data driven discussion; of which I could agree of most of your statements. Now it is, +0.1° is above average, the average high is 76° when it is actually 80°, blanket statements about all SE Michigan locations when you mean just Detroit, etc.

        6. Travis (Oakland County) says:

          I don’t think the Flint office even does those types of write-ups do they, so I figured you’d know it was Detroit. You said yourself Flint is usually left out of the discussion.

          And I never got the average high 4 degrees off. Not sure where you got that?

          You were saying the weather we were going to get next week was typical summer weather and I said it’s atypical since the average high for me next week will be in the upper 70′s.

        7. DF (SE Mich) says:

          The Detroit NWS office (White Lake) covers all the SE Michigan climate stations, Flint, Saginaw and Detroit.

          The Saginaw station has been around since 1900 and Flint since 1921. Although stations move over time and MD-80′s blow exhaust on them, the data (for what it is worth) is still out there.

    2. DF (SE Mich) says:

      The 850mb freezing line is also below Hudson Bay around the 4th… fall is coming just like every year.

  3. Jack Martin says:

    Thank You Bill, We sure do need the rain. Looks to be another hot one today! Already starting to see the leaves slowly changing colors here in my neck of the woods in Fennville.

  4. Nathan says:

    Is the cause of this heat wave from a ridge or a high pressure or global warming :p? If it is a ridge then we must be far away from the jetstream since there is no rain in sight until maybe Thursday.

    1. Travis (Oakland County) says:

      Short-term events are weather. The climate is years and years worth of weather combined into one big picture.

      The heat has been there all along, just look at the summer they had out west. It’s just finally becoming a more progressive pattern for the eastern US now.

        1. Mike M. says:

          Yawn. The real temperature for the globe in July comes in at 0.17°C over average you big, fat, greasy twinkie…


        2. Nathan (Forest Hills) says:

          Ok, thanks for the information, it always helps :)

        3. big Daddy BC says:

          Exxon Spencer is your source? LOL I don’t think we’ll trust a guy who works for Exxon.

        4. Bill Steffen says:

          Liar – you know he doesn’t “work for Exxon”. Read:

          “Roy W. Spencer received his Ph.D. in meteorology at the University of Wisconsin-Madison in 1981. Before becoming a Principal Research Scientist at the University of Alabama in Huntsville in 2001, he was a Senior Scientist for Climate Studies at NASA’s Marshall Space Flight Center, where he and Dr. John Christy received NASA’s Exceptional Scientific Achievement Medal for their global temperature monitoring work with satellites. Dr. Spencer’s work with NASA continues as the U.S. Science Team leader for the Advanced Microwave Scanning Radiometer flying on NASA’s Aqua satellite. He has provided congressional testimony several times on the subject of global warming.

          Dr. Spencer’s research has been entirely supported by U.S. government agencies: NASA, NOAA, and DOE. He has never been asked by any oil company to perform any kind of service. Not even Exxon-Mobil.

          Dr. Spencer’s first popular book on global warming, Climate Confusion (Encounter Books), is now available at Amazon.com and BarnesAndNoble.com.”

          He uses NASA data and you can find the data on the web and plot it yourself. Outside of being a serial liar and libeler – what’s your credentials?

        5. big Daddy BC says:

          Spencer does get paid by Exxon. He works for Heartland and is a board member of the George C Marshall Institute! Both entities are funded by Exxon, Exxon, Exxon!

          In his book, The Great Global Warming Blunder, he writes,

          “I find it difficult to believe that I am the first researcher to figure out what I describe in this book. Either I am smarter than the rest of the world’s climate scientists–which seems unlikely–or there are other scientists who also have evidence that global warming could be mostly natural, but have been hiding it. That is a serious charge, I know, but it is a conclusion that is difficult for me to avoid.” (p. xxvii)

          LOL Talk about a conspiracy theorist! Hilarious! This guys actually believes that scientists all over the world are sitting on evidence that would support his ridiculous position and that it’s just a matter of time before he’s proven right!

        6. Bill Steffen says:

          Spencer doesn’t “work for Heartland”. Can’t you stop lying for a comment or two? Here’s where you can read about Dr. Spencer: http://www.drroyspencer.com/about/ Read this: http://www.drroyspencer.com/global-warming-background-articles/

          Read this: http://www.drroyspencer.com/global-warming-101/

          His testimony before the U.S. Senate: http://www.drroyspencer.com/2013/07/senate-epw-hearing-climate-change-its-happened-before/

          Here’s a Nobel Prize Winner who agrees with Dr. Spencer:

          Quote by Nobel Prize Winner For Physics, Ivar Giaever: “I am a skeptic…Global warming has become a new religion.”

  5. INDY says:

    Hey Travis seek some work …U have lots of time on hand!!! Facts it is summer and it should be hot this little heat wave will not make it even close to above avg. summer your time is running out deep breaths little guy fall is coming!!! INDYY

  6. big Daddy BC says:

    As an aside, anyone paying attention to unemployment in Michigan. Holy Smokes, Snyder’s got us up at 8.8%. On top of that, gas prices here are among the highest in the nation. This after passing a litany of anti-labor laws he promised would send “corporations racing into our state.” The rest of the country has slid down to 7.4%. Apparently raping the middle class isn’t working. The greatest job creators are not corporations, they’re us. Write the nerd and let him know this is still the labor state! Get this regime outta here!

    I do feel sorry for the democrat that will inherit this mess. He’ll face the same mess Obama did when trying to clean up Bush’s disaster.


    1. SlimJim NW GR (1) says:

      In Michigan was well as across the country the vast majority of the new jobs that the so called “job creators” have (created?) have been part time low wage no benefits jobs. And that looks to continue well into the future regardless of the party runs the state/country.

    2. Travis (Oakland County) says:

      Michigan unemployment peaked at almost 14% under Granholm, while the national was only 10%.

      If anything, Michigan is leading the way as the state’s economy is improving at a much faster rate than the rest of the country.

      The auto industry over here in SE Michigan is especially booming right now.

      1. Bill Steffen says:

        Interesting side note on that…the #1 demo group for buying new autos is now age 55-65. Auto makers have been targeting young demos, but seems they are cautious because of poor job prospects and high student loan debt. So, watch for more ads aimed at older demos rather than the 18-29 group.

    3. Bill Steffen says:

      From YOUR link, bigDaddy: “From April to July 2013, the number of employed youth 16 to 24 years old rose 2.1 million to 19.7 million. This year, the share of young people employed in July was 50.7 percent.” So only HALF of the people between 16-24 who want a job are working! Many in the other half are burdened by student loans.

      “Real average hourly earnings for all employees fell 0.2 percent from June to July, seasonally adjusted, the
      U.S. Bureau of Labor Statistics reported today. This decline stems from a 0.1 percent decrease in
      average hourly earnings and a 0.2 percent increase in the Consumer Price Index for All Urban
      Consumers (CPI-U).

      Real average weekly earnings fell 0.5 percent over the month due to the decrease in real average hourly
      earnings and a 0.3 percent decrease in the average workweek.”

      The LOWEST monthly unemployment under Obama has been 7.4% – that compares to an AVERAGE of 5.3% under George Bush (Jr.) (for all 8 years) and 5.1% under Bill Clinton…and even 6.6% under Jimmy Carter! That doesn’t include the millions who have dropped out of the workforce and those who are now working, but part time. You’re going to see more public-sector (union jobs) and private sector jobs going to part-time to get under the Obamacare 30-hour mandate.

      Obama’s approval rating is at an all-time low: http://www.newsmax.com/Politics/gallup-obama-economic-approval/2013/08/15/id/520644

      1. big Daddy BC says:

        You don’t think that employment stat might have something to do with college, seasonal work, etc.??

        I didn’t post that stat about the ridiculously high unemployment rate in MI to debate you on Obama, but to publicly laugh at your support of a governor and fringe legislature that passed more than 100 anti union bills with the promise that hurting labor would improve jobs. It hasn’t happened. Unemployment is growing, not shrinking. You promised it would shrink, Bill. Why isn’t it? Maybe if they lowered minimum wage or cut more benefits or allowed for children to work in factories your fat-cat corporate buddies would start hiring. LOL You don’t have a clue.

        1. Bill Steffen says:

          As Travis pointed out…the actual “ridiculously high unemployment rate in Michigan” was under Granholm. Michigan did worse than any other state. Now we have improved RELATIVE TO OTHER STATES. http://detroit.cbslocal.com/2013/05/09/experts-rank-michigan-8th-most-competitive-state-for-economic-development/ (instead of being in the top ten for economic growth, we were in the bottom ten under Granholm)

        2. big Daddy BC says:

          But it was you that promised decreasing not INCREASING unemployment rates when Michigan became a ‘right to work for less’ state. Granholm, btw, was operating under the Bush regime. Much of the country went in to double digit unemployment after Bush and his team crashed the economy. How short your memory has become.

        3. Bill Steffen says:

          Here’s Michigan unemployment: http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LASST26000003?data_tool=XGtable down 2.5% since Snyder took office. The Michigan unemployment rate today is lower than it was when Right to Work was signed on 12/11/12.

          BTW, hope you and you’re hot-dog-vendor-hating ilk are working on your next Election Proposal. I think you ought to try Proposal 2 all over again. The staff and management of Bill’s Blog is here to assist you with your advertising needs. Banner ads on Bill’s Blog will reach hundreds of thousands. Don’t make the same mistake (well, one of the many mistakes you made), buy banner ads on Bill’s Blog.

        4. big Daddy BC says:

          Are you really trying to taunt those hurt by the fringe right and AmWay’s hand puppet? I think there might be more than a handful of labor lovers in west Michigan.

        5. Bill Steffen says:

          The “fringe right” that voted down Prop. 2 included over 700,000 people who voted for Obama. The vast middle class sees you and your ilk as another special interest group, interested only in your members and not the poor and middle class. I love “labor” – the work that my fellow workers do every day at WOOD-TV – the vast numbers of average people who work in the private sector that pay your salary and pension…the people you look down on. You aren’t helping them. You want to hurt them with “skyrocketing” energy bills and $9 a gallon “European level” gasoline prices.

        6. big Daddy BC says:

          The middle class pays your wages, Bill. You rich guys pay much lower tax rates than the rest of us. Your employer pays NO taxes in Michigan. That’s welfare and it’s not fair. You wealthy fat cats should have to pay as much as the rest of us.

          Unions protect their members, it’s true, and that’s why union jobs pay better and provide better benefit packages. Those shops that compete with union shops are forced to raise their wages, taking money from the exuberant bonuses enjoyed by CEOs and dividends payed out to their rich shareholders. True, unions created the middle class in the ’50s and help working families everywhere. I’m not sure how that’s a bad thing, unless you’re running the company.

        7. Bill Steffen says:

          Advertisers pay my wages. I pay a boatload of money in tax. The government ought to thank me for creating the wealth for you climate profiteers to confiscate and waste (http://nation.foxnews.com/obama/2012/10/20/list-36-obama-s-taxpayer-funded-green-energy-failures). I even pay a hefty tax to the city of Grand Rapids, payment for driving on the pothole-filled roads (there’s a pothole in from on the Nantucket Bakery on Union that could swallow a Smart Car – dangerous to anyone on a bicycle). With all the money I pay, you’d think they’d let me swim in their swimming pools at a resident rate. It’s taxation without representation.

          Unions do protect their members…while at the same time possibly endangering children: http://www.mlive.com/news/bay-city/index.ssf/2012/10/bay_city_teachers_union_gave_4.html Why would the teachers union write language into a contract that would allow a teacher drunk 4 times to still be in the classroom…or dealing drugs on the playground and keep his job? Why?

    4. Mike M. says:

      Overpasses for Obama’s impeachment…


      I need to find a dummy I can dress up as a rodeo clown. What are you doing Saturday, Bdbc?

      1. big Daddy BC says:

        Your Mom and I have are going out for seafood.

        1. Paul says:

          She should have fun when you spread your legs bdbc, lol.

        2. Mike M. says:

          She will not have fun with Bigduddy, the Man With No Penis. When you post as Mindy, do you feel more feminine, BD?

        3. big Daddy BC says:

          I don’t care what your Mom calls me, Mike, as long as she keeps on calling me.

        4. Bill Steffen says:

          Quote by Nobel Prize Winner For Physics, Ivar Giaever: “I am a skeptic…Global warming has become a new religion.”

      2. Jo Anne says:

        Notice they always blame Bush for the nations woes! Who wants to keep on spending on lavish vacations, parties, arming the enemy (Moslem Brotherhood) and so much more, when government needs to cut back on their own lavish lifestyle and learn to live like the rest of us!

      3. Jo Anne says:

        This is cool (Overpasses)! Great idea–Hope it happens!

  7. Mindy says:

    I’m on your side big Daddy!! Jobs, LOL, Thanks to SLICK RICK SNYDER he TAXING My Pension!!! Never before untill he got elected, TAKING STATE TAXES OUT OF MY PENSION!!!! RECALL THIS %$#@*&!!!!!

    1. Bill Steffen says:

      So, Mindy…do you think ALL pensions should be tax-free, or just union pensions? Remember, the vast majority of people in the private sector don’t get pensions…and a lot of people who make LESS income while working are paying taxes to pay the pensions of people who make more from their pension than public-sector union retirees get from their pension! Look at the young people who are saddled with huge student loans (partly because the cost of college has gone up well beyond the rate of inflation for years…with more and more employees added to “management” as student enrollment has been steady or even in some cases declining). Now we have Obamacare and the massive move by universities and the rest of the public sector to reduce employees to under 30 hours: http://www.detroitnews.com/article/20130808/OPINION01/308080008

      1. big Daddy BC says:

        Unions don’t give pensions, Bill. Any employer can give a pension. Unions aren’t employers AND the tax payers of Michigan are not paying for public sector pensions. Hell, under several repub governors money was taken from the pension to pay for OTHER debts, a bonus for those who don’t pay into that system…until the constitutionally protected bill came due.

        I appreciate your concern for young people and the debt they accumulate trying to pay for college and am therefor confused by your support for a governor that restructured school funding to include colleges in the same revenue stream as k-12 schools. On one hand you steal from the schools to give tax breaks to the rich, but on the other hand you feel bad about it. Touching.

        1. Bill Steffen says:

          We taxpayers pay the pensions of public-sector employees and people are looking at the early retirement, the lucrative defined pensions, the lifetime health care (and boy to unions want out of Obamacare!), vision, dental, chiropractic. Families who are struggling to make ends meet on 25 or 30K a year are forced to pay for pensions of 45K (and how much money would you have to save to spin off 45K a year in interest!) plus all the benefits.

        2. big Daddy BC says:

          Prove it. The only reason any tax payers have had to supplement the public pension system is because repubs have borrowed from it. That burden is yet another example of irresponsible GOP policies that reward the rich and hurt the middle class.

        3. big Daddy BC says:

          A quick search finds that Engler took $170 million from the pension fund. It wasn’t put back. In ’94 PROP A freed the state from having to pay into the pension system at all. Your info is outdated by nineteen years. LOL

        4. Bill Steffen says:

          Michigan can’t print money like the Fed. We have a balanced budget now (after the multi-million dollar debt that Granholm left). People pay taxes and some of that tax money pays for public sector pensions and benefits. You have no sense of fairness, no compassion for the people who are working more hours and retiring later for less money in salary than many public employees get in retirement.

          If Obamacare is so wonderful…why do the unions want no part of it? http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/wonkblog/wp/2013/08/05/a-lot-of-unions-are-going-to-end-up-hating-obamacare/


        5. big Daddy BC says:

          Who in the hell was talkin’ about Obama Care? Stick to the topic. Engler stole the pension fund and now you’re blaming the retirees. More moth eaten rhetoric from dusty old Steffen.

        6. Bill Steffen says:

          Engler didn’t “steal” your pension. And he isn’t a polygamist either. Answer the question…why are all the unions opposed to Obamacare.

        7. big Daddy BC says:

          I can’t imagine more than one woman that would have him. He did cut funding for MPSERS over two years to the tune of almost 200 million, crippling the fund. It’s history. Look it up, Magoo.

    2. Mark (East Lansing) says:

      What’s a pension?

      1. Rob( Norton Shores) says:

        Pensions are for people who can’t think on their own, you know save your money and invest in something that’s going to make you money, so you have it for retirement….

      2. DF (SE Mich) says:

        Exactly Mark!!!!

        1. big Daddy BC says:

          You’re right, DF. Pensions are quickly becoming a thing of the past, along with the right to organize.

        2. Bill Steffen says:

          Actually, not only individuals now have the right not to be forced to join a union as a condition of state employment (and thereby being forced to contribute to a group that demanded in their contract to leave drunk and drug-dealing teachers in the classroom: http://www.mlive.com/news/bay-city/index.ssf/2012/10/bay_city_teachers_union_gave_4.html ), but entire group of union members have opted out of the union: http://www.grandhaventribune.com/article/221976 http://laborpains.org/2013/05/17/fewer-unions-survive-decertification-elections/

        3. big Daddy BC says:

          How are those policies helping unemployment in Michigan?

          “Unemployment rate climbs in Lansing to 8.4%, 0.7% more than June. In Jackson the rate is now 9.4%, up 0.6% from June.”

        4. Bill Steffen says:


          Unemployment went up to 14.2% under Granholm. The Michigan economy is better now. After Michigan unemployment was in the bottom half when Engler was governor…the unemployment rate rose to #1…worse state in the entire U.S.!! http://data.bls.gov/timeseries/LASST26000003?data_tool=XGtable

          Relative to other states…we did worse under Granholm, we’re doing better under Snyder and his bipartisan approach to economic growth (Snyder’s Treasury Secretary is a Democrat).

        5. big Daddy BC says:

          Granholm suffered under the GOP Bush regime as did the entire nation. Yes we got it worse, dummy. When Detroit tanked, so did the entire state. Ever hear the old expression about keeping your eggs in one basket? Bush dropped ours and now you want to blame our governor. Fact is, Snyder’s policies are insulating us against the recovery. Michigan’s no better off now than it was when Dick’s hand puppet took office. The only one’s lovin’ it are the wealthy, people like you.

        6. Bill Steffen says:

          Michigan did WORSE than ANY OTHER STATE under Granholm. When Granholm took office (1/1/03), the unemployment rate was 6.6%. When she left office (1/1/11), the unemployment rate was 11.0%. That was a bump up of 4.4%. It was worse than any other state. The unemployment rate is down to 8.8% since Snyder took office. We got rid of the job-killing Michigan Business Tax and replaced it with what Democrat Andy Dillon called a “simpler, fairer tax”.

          Detroit’s been tanking for decades.

          Read this: http://www.hollandsentinel.com/news/x1806123323/Michigans-economy-continues-to-improve

        7. big Daddy BC says:

          When Detroit tanked, so did the entire state. Ever hear the old expression about keeping your eggs in one basket? Bush dropped ours and now you want to blame our governor. Fact is, Snyder’s policies are insulating us against the recovery. Michigan’s no better off now than it was when Dick’s hand puppet took office. The only one’s lovin’ it are the wealthy, people like you.

        8. Bill Steffen says:

          Face it…The Michigan unemployment rate soared under Granholm…to worst in the country…up to 14.2%. The unemployment rate is down 2.5% since Snyder took office. We are now doing better than most states at creating jobs and growing our economy. We were doing much worse than other states under Granholm, we are doing better than most states now. We are moving in the right direction. A primary reason is the end of the job-killing Michigan Business Tax. It was replaced with a “simpler and fairer” (the words of Democrat Andy Dillon) corporate tax. Detroit’s been tanking for years…the result of greed and the typical borrow and spend policies that result in bankruptcy and a lack of money to provide services. 43% of the Detroit budget goes to pay pensions. 43%!! That’s not sustainable.

      3. big Daddy BC says:

        A pension is a savings plan, Rob. Both the employee and employer pay into it. It’s part of a benefit package that’s managed by treasury. It’s no different than using a bank to manage your investments, except that the buying power is much greater. Don’t be jealous that Walmart doesn’t offer you the same kind of security. People who work for Walmart know full well they won’t be treated nicely. It’s kind of their M.O.

        1. Rob( Norton Shores) says:

          I’ve got my own business…..so no pension and I know how the world economy works. I farm fruit and know how chain stores operate….I’m the lowest man on the totem pole. I make what money I can in about three months time, and budget two years out, because next year could be devastating. So a pension and taxes please spare me the whining from the left put on your boots and do something. Now let’s talk about weather……I need the rain!!!!

        2. big Daddy BC says:

          Congrats on your less than successful fruit enterprise. I’m sorry you chose a profession that’s dependent on the weather cooperating. Too bad you vote for policies that allow polluters to continue to create a climate that’s taking money out of your pocket. Good luck with that.

        3. big Daddy BC says:

          The Wall Street Journal is owned by the same British billionaire that owns FOX NEWS. Are you kidding, because your sense of humor is geeky and a little creepy.

        4. Bill Steffen says:

          Of course, you can’t dispute the content, can you.

          Quote by Will Harper, Princeton University physicist, former Director of Energy Research at the Department of Energy: “I had the privilege of being fired by Al Gore, since I refused to go along with his alarmism….I have spent a long research career studying physics that is closely related to the greenhouse effect….Fears about man-made global warming are unwarranted and are not based on good science. The earth’s climate is changing now, as it always has. There is no evidence that the changes differ in any qualitative way from those of the past.”

  8. SlimJim NW GR (1) says:

    There has been some discussion as to how “hot” this summer has been compared to the last 100 to 125 years here in lower Michigan. So lets see how far off from “average” this summer has been here in parts of lower Michigan. We will start off in Grand Rapids and use July as the sample month. The “old” averages I will use are from a book written by Richard Keen in “Michigan Weather”
    In Grand Rapids the daily average high for July was 82.8° and the average low was 62.7° from the book the averages for Grand Rapids are (page 83) H 83° L 60° so the daytime this year was average and the nights were warmer. In Detroit this year the average high was 82.5 (airport) and the low was 65.6° from the book the average high for July is (page 83) at the airport 84° and the average low 60 and at “city airport) the average high is (was) 83 and the low 64° Once again the overnight lows were warmer this year. Now lets look at Flint this July the average high was 83.3 and the low was 62.7 and from page 83 in the book the average high for July is 81 and the low was 59 so Flint came in warmer both day and night this year (from e 1960 1990 averages) and as for Saginaw. This year Saginaw July’ s average high was 81.8 and the low was 61.7 and on page 84 in the book the high was 82 and the low was 60. Now what dose all this tell us? For the most part this year July was just an average July and this summer well end up being just an average summer (temp wise) BTW the book “Michigan Weather” contains a lot of good information on Michigan’s past weather and while its now getting a little dated if you can find a copy its still worth looking at.

    1. Travis (Oakland County) says:

      Or you can just let NWS do the work for you and save yourself the hassle ;)


      Haven’t seen one put out by NWS GRR yet.

      1. SlimJim NW GR (1) says:

        Travis (Oakland County) says:

        August 20, 2013 at 8:45 am

        Looks like all three SE Michigan locations are all but guaranteed another warmer than average summer… after the warmest 3 year summer stretch on record.

        No, it looks like this summer will end up near average and not warmer this average. But a point can be made that this summers overnight lows have been warmer. But still the daytime highs have been near average and nothing more! (for July) I would think that August could end up also being near average.

        1. Travis (Oakland County) says:

          Slim, through August 18th, all three SE Mich locations were warmer than average. All you have to do is read the link I posted.

          Those numbers are only going to increase with the heat wave.

        2. DF (SE Mich) says:

          Travis, the point slim is making is +0.8°, or whatever summer ends up being above 0.0°, is AVERAGE for all intensive purposes. The concept that 0.0° is the only number that can be an average summer is not logical and something you wouldn’t even argue for earlier this year… something changed.

        3. Travis (Oakland County) says:

          It was for Detroit.

          And +0.8 is statistically significant in my book. A one degree rise in temperature is a huge deal when you’re talking about the climate.

        4. Bill Steffen says:

          Again….look at my link…look at Detroit, Flint and Saginaw – hottest summers: http://weatherhistorian.blogspot.com/2011/09/another-hot-summer-across-southeast.html

        5. Nathan (Forest Hills) says:

          I think it really depends on where the jet stream sets up… I haven’t seen any constant intensity of heat waves over the years. Maybe one or two years are very warm here or there… But look at 2009! I remember that summer as very cold and wet.

  9. Mark (East Lansing) says:

    Travis (Oakland County) says:
    August 20, 2013 at 8:45 am

    Looks like all three SE Michigan locations are all but guaranteed another warmer than average summer… after the warmest 3 year summer stretch on record.

    All three SE Michigan locations just had their warmest 3 year summer stretch on record? Please refer to DF’s 9:11 am reply above.

    1. Travis (Oakland County) says:

      ?? All correct. Not sure why you guys sit and constantly argue about the data links I post from the NWS.

      Please refer to my post at 9:22 AM

      1. Mark (East Lansing) says:

        Your link says nothing about Detroit, Flint, and Saginaw having their warmest 3 year summer stretch on record.

        1. Travis (Oakland County) says:

          My link shows their placement among all recorded years. Couldn’t find the back link, but it looks like Bill found it.

          Once gain, NWS Detroit was only talking about Detroit just experiencing the hottest 3 summer stretch on record.

      2. Bill Steffen says:

        Read this: http://weatherhistorian.blogspot.com/2011/09/another-hot-summer-across-southeast.html This is NOT the 3 hottest summers back-to-back-to-back. Look at your precious Flint – warmer in the 1930s.

        1. TrippedUpDaddy(Belmont) says:

          *cough* 2009 *cough*

          In addition, with the exception of the 60′s and 70′s, that chart looks like a pretty even spread of dates for hottest summers. With the way Travis has been arguing, I would have expected to see a lot more 1990′s – 2013′s in the mix.

        2. big Daddy BC says:

          Yet NOAA says this was the sixth warmest July on record.

        3. Bill Steffen says:

          The data says global temperatures have been FLAT for over 10 years: http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs_v3/Fig.C.gif

          Even James Hansen wrote that global temperatures haven’t risen in over a decade: “The five-year mean global temperature has been flat for the last decade…” – James Hansen et

          The climate models are failing miserably: http://www.climatedialogue.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Figure-2-Pielke.jpg Dr. Judith Curry said the climate models are “deeply flawed”.

          CO2 emissions in the U.S. are FALLING: http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2012/08/in-a-surprise-co2-emissions-hit-20-year-low/1#.UhQ87n9C7Sg

          The Antarctic icecap is setting daily records for greatest extent: http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/antarctic.sea.ice.interactive.html and has been getting bigger for 25 years: http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/seaice.anomaly.antarctic.png

          Read this: http://noconsensus.org/scientists/freeman_dyson.php

        4. big Daddy BC says:

          The Antarctic is growing BECAUSE of the increase in humidity due to increased greenhouse gases and warming. Imagine the Antarctic as a cold desert with no precip. Where’s the moisture come from…warmer air. DOI!


        5. Robert(Plainwell) says:

          bDBC your an absolute idiot for believeing that garbage about Antartica.

        6. Bill Steffen says:

          Yeah, right…global warming causes ice to disappear at one Pole and pile up at the other Pole. Sure, the Emperor’s New Clothes are just beautiful!! LOL! The ice is growing at the South Pole because it’s GETTING COLDER!! http://www.john-daly.com/stations/amundsen.gif

  10. big Daddy BC says:

    “The average temperature for the contiguous United State during July was 74.3°F, 0.8°F above the 20th century average.”


    A few threads ago, Bill was claiming July was exactly average. LOL I think he got that little piece of misinformation from good old Bastardi. Come on, Magoo. You can do better.

    1. Bill Steffen says:

      The NASA GLOBAL anomaly for July 2013 was -0.087 deg. C. That’s unadjusted, untampered-with raw temperature data…no “use Mike’s TRICK to HIDE THE DECLINE” The global temperature has cooled faster in the start of the decade of the 2010s than in any start of any decade relative to the previous decade. Global temperatures have been flat for over a decade. Even James Hansen admits it: “The five-year mean global temperature has been flat for the last decade… – James Hansen et al.

      As Dr. Judith Curry says, The climate models are “deeply flawed”:


      1. big Daddy BC says:

        And he, again, regurgitates his favorite misquotes as evidence of scientific incompetence. LOL

        Here’s what Hansen really thinks:


        1. Bill Steffen says:

          There you are again with Ted. How can we possibly believe a guy who opens with pictures of Al Gore? http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/08/current-staffers-al-gore-al-jazeera_n_2432512.html BTW, Al has taken both the hockey stick (schtick) and the pic. of the polar bear out of his slide show. http://www.npr.org/2013/02/02/170779528/the-inconvenient-truth-about-polar-bears

          This is what Hansen really wrote: “The five-year mean global temperature has been flat for the last decade…” – James Hansen et al Hansen wrote that in 2013. You’re link is from Feb. 2012.

          You should debate him. See what he thinks of nuclear energy!

        2. big Daddy BC says:

          Ted isn’t a guy, Magoo. LOL And it’s not Ted talking, it’s Hansen, the guy you keep quoting. Why not listen to the words from his lips rather than your continual misrepresentation of his meaning. I’d trust Ted over Bill any day.

        3. Bill Steffen says:

          Ted starts the video with pictures of Al Gore. Gore’s the ultimate climate profiteer! http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2013/01/08/current-staffers-al-gore-al-jazeera_n_2432512.html

          Isn’t Hansen the guy who’s been trying to tell you that global temperatures are flat – and have been for over a decade? Why don’t you believe him?

          “The five-year mean global temperature has been flat for the last decade…” – James Hansen et al.

    2. Travis (Oakland County) says:

      It seems when temps are less than a degree difference, everyone on here calls it “average.” But really, one degree rise over a 50 year period is a huge deal when you’re talking about the climate.

      July 2013 was the 341st month in a row with global temperatures running above average.

      Year-to-date, 2013 is now tied for 6th warmest year ever recorded so far. So probably looking at another top 10 year. Surprise, surprise.

      Not since February 1985 has the planet seen a cooler than average month.


      1. Bill Steffen says:

        That is “adjusted” nonsense. Make the past cooler by “adjusting” temperatures downward and using a small number of selected sites. http://icecap.us/index.php/go/joes-blog/central_park_in_ushcnv25_october_2012_magically_becomes_cooler_in_july_in_t/

        1. Travis (Oakland County) says:

          Our current averages that you always reference have been adjusted upward. In a much larger manner too.


        2. Bill Steffen says:

          The National Weather Service has always used a moving 30-year average…the last 3 full 3 decades. So now, we are using the 1981-2010 climate normals. Every 10 years, a decade is eliminated and a new decade is added to the average. When the added decade is cooler than the decade being eliminated, the average will go up, as it did in 2010…when we added 2001-2010 and eliminated the cold decade of 1971-1980. In 1981, the climate average went down because we added 1971-80 and eliminated the warmer decade of 1941-1950.

          Look at January temperatures by decade for Grand Rapids and you’ll have an idea of how the temperature has gone up and down…and over 100 years, we’re right back where we started: http://blogs.woodtv.com/2011/01/25/january-temp-by-decade/

        3. Bill Steffen says:

          First, the hadcrut data is wrong…it was not a half degree cooler in the 1930s than it is now. The raw data doesn’t show that. Second even that fudged, adjusted graph shows a rise of a touch less than one degree, certainly within the range of change due to solar/ocean currents/volcanoes or lack of volcanoes. Third, the climate models are failing miserably: http://www.climatedialogue.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Figure-2-Pielke.jpg

          Quote by George Kukla, climatologist, research scientist with the Lamont-Doherty Earth Observatory at Columbia University: “The only thing to worry about is the damage that can be done by worrying. Why are some scientists worried? Perhaps because they feel that to stop worrying may mean to stop being paid.”

      2. DF (SE Mich) says:

        You are confused I think 1°C has been noted as “significant” by many reports but not 1°F. 1°F is well within a standard deviation for a summer.

        1. DF (SE Mich) says:

          Travis, for example, I did a half a.. calculation really quick for yearly temperatures and one standard deviation for Detroit is around 2.6°F. Inside that is closer to average than not to me, and surely inside 1°F is average statistically.

        2. Travis (Oakland County) says:

          Okay, we will respectfully disagree.

          The whole warming the planet has seen the past 100 years is +1.4 degrees Fahrenheit and that has had widespread consequences.

          Therefore, I stick to my belief that 1 degree is statistically significant. Anything less than 0.1 would not be, which is also the view of the NWS.

        3. big Daddy BC says:

          Hey, DF. I think you’re confused. You cannot apply a simple statistical test here.


          “…such a statistical null hypothesis may not be a well-posed problem in the context of the evaluation of climate change scenarios. Therefore, the usage of terms such “statistically significant scenario” may be misunderstood in the general discourse about the certainty of projected climate change. “

        4. Bill Steffen says:

          Travis – The Michigan State Climatologist has said that Michigan is roughly one degree warmer now than it was 100 years ago…but…almost all the change has been to minimum temperatures and primarily in winter. The one degree is confined to a very small box. This would suggest we look at other possibilities instead of CO2. Over 100 years, we have moved weather stations to airports, where there’s a lot of buildings, asphalt and concrete. There’s air and vehicular traffic to stir the air (cold air settles at the ground on calm, clear nights – especially over a winter snowpack.

        5. big Daddy BC says:

          Hey, Bill. The Berkeley Earth team discounted contaminated stations by removing them from the overall equation. The results were the same. The trend is clear.


        6. Bill Steffen says:

          wotsupwiththat? How can you…I mean, seriously, how can you get on my (and other commentors) case for linking to Anthony Watts (www.wattsupwiththat.com) when you’ve linked to the SEIU bulletin and wotsupwiththat? I don’t care that you do…just pointing out the hypocrisy.

          You cited the BEST group at Berkeley. Here’s what Dr. Richard Muller said about the climate profiteers, about ClimateGate and “using Mike’s TRICK to HIDE the decline”: “THEY DECEIVED…IT WOULD NOT HAVE SURVIVED PEER REVIEW…ILLUSION…I NOW HAVE A LIST OF PEOPLE WHO’S PAPERS I WON’T READ ANYMORE..YOU’RE NOT ALLOWED TO DO THIS IN SCIENCE…THIS IS NOT UP TO OUR STANDARDS”.

          I don’t think the Berkeley climate siting dismissal was peer-reviewed.

          The American Assn. of State Climatologists has commended Anthony Watts for his work on exposing the poor quality of weather stations. This is a good website to ingest: http://www.surfacestations.org/ Here’s just a few examples of poor siting: http://www.surfacestations.org/odd_sites.htm

    3. big Daddy BC says:

      It’s interesting that Bill always has some data to disagree with NOAA, yet it’s never from a credible source. If you want to use NASA data, Bill. Please actually use NASA and not activists like Pielke. In the meantime, we’ll accept NOAA as the authority.


      1. Bill Steffen says:

        Here’s the unadjusted data from NASA: http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs_v3/Fig.C.gif It shows the obvious – that global temperatures are flat since 2002 and actually down a touch since 2009. Everyone accepts this graph, even James Hansen:

        “The five-year mean global temperature has been flat for the last decade…” – James Hansen et al

        1. big Daddy BC says:

          Interesting that graph only goes back to ’96…hmmm

        2. Bill Steffen says:

          That’s how NASA makes the graph. The graph clearly shows that global temperatures have been flat since at least 2002. The data clearly shows the total failure of the climate models: http://www.climatedialogue.org/wp-content/uploads/2013/05/Figure-2-Pielke.jpg Dr. Judith Curry, head of Climate Science at Georgia Tech Univ. and a member of the BEST group at Berkeley has stated the obvious, that the climate models are “deeply flawed”.

  11. flyguy says:

    Bill, why do they always adjust the raw data? Isn’t the raw data the data?

    1. Bill Steffen says:

      There’s a lot of funding and jobs dependent on the issue of climate change. NASA alone gets 2 billion dollars. There’s a lot of money to be made with cronies friendly to the powers that be and a lot of taxes that can be raised, a lot of regulations that can be put in place that will ultimately not move global temperature a hundredth of a degree, but would financially hurt the poor and middle class (“skyrocketing” energy bills and $9 a gallon “European level” gasoline prices.

      1. Brad says:

        OK, I’ll try. Bill, why are the data adjusted? Your conspiracy theory is a joke!

        1. big Daddy BC says:

          Raw data from ‘REAL SCIENCE?’ I don’t think we’ll accept ‘data’ from activist sites.

        2. Bill Steffen says:

          I knew you wouldn’t be able to any of the data and facts that are presented at the link.


          http://www.nytimes.com/2013/06/11/science/earth/what-to-make-of-a-climate-change-plateau.html?_r=2& From the link: “The rise in the surface temperature of earth has been markedly slower over the last 15 years. And that lull in warming has occurred even as greenhouse gases have accumulated in the atmosphere at a record pace.

          The slowdown is a bit of a mystery to climate scientists. But given how much is riding on the scientific forecast, the practitioners of climate science would like to understand exactly what is going on. They admit that they do not…”

          “They admit THEY DO NOT…” And that’s the New York Times!! CO2 emissions in the U.S. are falling: http://content.usatoday.com/communities/ondeadline/post/2012/08/in-a-surprise-co2-emissions-hit-20-year-low/1#.UhQ87n9C7Sg Global temperatures are flat, just like the NY Times says: http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs_v3/Fig.C.gif The Antarctic ice cap is going to set a daily record extent this week…and could see an all-time greatest extent record in Sept.

        3. Brad says:

          So…why are temperatures adjusted?

        4. Bill Steffen says:

          This graph was done by the State Climatologist of California, Jim Goodridge: http://www.seafriends.org.nz/issues/global/goodridge_1996_ca-uhi_county.jpg I don’t have a URL handy but after he retired he updated this graphic in 2009. It shows there is a significant urbanization effect at higher population climate stations and that stations that remained in undisturbed areas saw no temperature increase (there was a small increase in the 2009 graphic, consistent with the flip to the warm phase of the PDO).

          By selecting certain stations and using those to extrapolate temperatures over a larger area, you can get a far different result. I saw one data set for S. America that did not contain a single weather station in Bolivia (a high elevation and cooler region). Coastal and lower elevation locations were extrapolated over Bolivia. You can’t do that!

          My brother-in-law is a head research scientist at the Oak Ridge Laboratory. He told me that “at least 80% of the scientists there think the CO2 scare is mostly nonsense”. He said the lab is loaded with top-notch Ph.Ds – lots of physics and chemistry (and now environmental) scientists. My brother-in-law has actually worked with Energy Sec. Chu on a couple of projects.

          There is a LOT of money involved here. Many people feel they can’t speak out, esp. if they work for the government or get government contracts. The 97% figure that is thrown out is nonsense. I would have said “yes” to the two questions they asked. As with many issues, there is a broad range of opinion…it’s not just black and white. Skepticism is growing because the climate models have not predicted the decade-plus of steady global temperatures: http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamestaylor/2013/02/13/peer-reviewed-survey-finds-majority-of-scientists-skeptical-of-global-warming-crisis/

        5. big Daddy BC says:

          Good question, Brad. How exactly are the numbers being ‘adjusted,’ Bill? Maybe your super smart brother-in-law and his rebel scientist friends could explain it. Yeah right.


        6. big Daddy BC says:

          LOL He still can’t answer the question!!!

          Seems like as much as you talk about those adjustments you’d be able to describe them.

        7. Bill Steffen says:

          First I’ll give you their take: http://cdiac.ornl.gov/trends/temp/hansen/hansen.html Keep in mind there have been many adjustments, with each adjustment cooling the past and warming the present. They virtually wiped out the 1930s heat. That is 100% contrary to the actual temperature data. For instance, Grand Rapids was one degree F warmer in the decade of the 1930s than in the decade of the 2000s. You’ll find that over most long-established and unurbanized weather stations.

          Decades ago, we only measured temperature accurately over about 10% of the globe…we didn’t have satellites to see over the oceans. There was virtually no data over the Poles and significant sections of Asia and Africa. Even your graph shows a warming of about one degree since 1880. How do we know exactly what the temperature over the oceans and poles was in the late 1800s, or even in the 1940s? The answer is we don’t. It’s even worse when you try and look back centuries.

          The ClimateGate emails clearly showed collusion to force a pre-defined conclusion. Starting with a desired outcome that would bring fame and money to the conspirators and knowing they would have a compliant press, they contrived evidence to fit that conclusion. For anyone interested, you really should read the ClimateGate emails. I think you’ll come to the same conclusion as Dave the Biologist who wrote this in the NY Times:

          ““I also have to agree with Jim West. My firm ‘belief’ in AGW had already been undermined by some extremely bad papers about mosquitoes, arthropod borne disease, and the effect a warmer Earth on wildlife (I am a biologist). But, I assumed these were just opportunists jumping on the gravy train and that the problem was with the journal review process, not AGW.

          But the Climategate emails made it all too clear that there was no science at all in ALL these famous papers in Nature and other ‘prestige’ journals. Rather, all the sound and fury appeared to be generated by an unscrupulous cabal eager for grant money, fame, and lots of CO2 generating trips to warm and pleasant spots where they could regurgitate their story to a corrupted press and conniving politicians.

          As far as I can tell now, many of the assumptions of AGW appear to be false, nothing that one reads on climate change from Nature to Drudge is reliable.”



          Here is just one problem with the recent climate record:

          This from the State Climatologist of Texas: “Big siting changes started in the late 1980s, as the thermometer of choice went from a standard liquid-in-glass thermometer to MMTS, a sensor that required electricity. Quite frequently, the measurement site ended up closer to buildings because that’s where the electricity was. …if you thought that the adjusted station data had eliminated effects due to poor siting, well for most temperature variables there’s still a ways to go.”

          Quote by Nobel Prize Winner For Chemistry, Kary Mullis: “Global warmers predict that global warming is coming, and our emissions are to blame. They do that to keep us worried about our role in the whole thing. If we aren’t worried and guilty, we might not pay their salaries. It’s that simple.

  12. INDY says:


    1. fixxxer says:

      So by your thinking everyone who posts on here needs a job? Doesnt meijers pay you enough to get a smartphone?

  13. Jack says:

    Ten Years After….50,000 Miles Beneath My Brain :::: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ugZU4ITYkuw. ;-)

    1. Bill Steffen says:

      Great song…I think this is my favorite Alvin Lee song: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rJMMO3lllww

  14. Travis (Oakland County) says:

    One of those weird days it’s hotter in the UP than Lower Michigan.

    Seeing some almost 90 degree temps already up there.

    1. Mark (East Lansing) says:

      Some? You mean one. Iron Mountain 88.

    2. Rodey (Rockford) says:

      Why do some people care if you have a job? Guess they have to get a life.

      1. fixxxer says:

        Cause indy and mike make minimum wage.

        1. Mark (East Lansing) says:

          When no one else will listen, you may as well talk to yourself.

        2. DF (SE Mich) says:

          LOL!!!!! Talking to himself…

        3. Michael g (se gr) says:

          Has to find a friend somewhere……

  15. I didn’t know that the weather could be so political. ;) Just stepped outside for a bit today and it is very nice outside!! Nice to have summer back again. Hopefully we see some storms… or at least some rain this week. I’m liking what the GFS has for 170-180hrs. Though that is way to far to know anything for sure yet. The scenario would bring rain back into west Michigan.

    1. Cort S. says:

      Mid-summer death ridge is go for launch! We had to delay it by a month due to budget cuts.

  16. Jen in Middleville says:

    I see 84 on the woodtv8 website!! So were you correct Bill, or was the high higher? When is the cooler weather going to come back?! I miss it.

    1. big Daddy BC says:

      “According to NOAA scientists, the globally averaged temperature for July 2013 was the sixth highest July since record keeping began in 1880. It also marked the 37th consecutive July and 341st consecutive month (more than 28 years) with a globally averaged temperature above the 20th century average.”


      Can’t wait for someone to prove that ‘natural variability’ hypothesis!

      1. Bill Steffen says:

        According to “unadjusted” raw data from NASA, Globally, July was -0.087 deg. C. BELOW average!

        Global temperatures have been steady for more than a decade: http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs_v3/Fig.C.gif (if you look at the NASA graph…temps. are actually down a touch since 2009).

        The decade of the 1930s was one degree warmer in G.R. than the decade of the 2000s…I’m sure you’ll find that same pattern with many weather stations with a consistent record and no effects from urbanization.

      2. yooper4021 says:

        So what?

        1. big Daddy BC says:

          A right wing blog thinks that because 2012 wasn’t hotter overall than nine other years, the Earth must be cooling. LOL You’re a bigger idiot than I gave you credit for.

        2. Bill Steffen says:

          From NASA: http://data.giss.nasa.gov/gistemp/graphs_v3/Fig.C.gif

          SPC says it could be a record LOW number of tornadoes this year: http://www.accuweather.com/en/weather-news/2012-may-challenge-records-for/2997002

          Only the 7th time in the last 50 years that we don’t have a tropical storm in the Atlantic/Caribbean/Gulf of Mexico.

        3. big Daddy BC says:

          That NASA data only goes back to ’96? Why’s that?

        4. Bill Steffen says:

          Go ask NASA – the graph is plain as the Pinocchio-nose on your face. Global temperatures have been flat since 2002 – there’s even a very slight downward trend since 2009.

    2. Nathan (Forest Hills) says:

      Jen, I think it was actually 85 degrees… So close! And about that cold weather, I am not seeing any relief in the 10 day outlook. I am no professional, so maybe someone else could get into details, but one thing is for sure… This week will be HOT!

  17. fixxxer says:

    Lmao…rj is crying under his moms bed. ;)

  18. Rob( Norton Shores) says:

    yes bigdaddy I do depend on the weather to farm that is a fact..you don’t know anything about how food gets to your table and my business is a success. I’ve been through very hard times with the death of my dad. I’ve managed to grow quality that’s what counts. as far as policy and bureaucracy you can stick it because in the long run it means nothing……remember all you need is food, shelter and family to be happy.

    1. big Daddy BC says:

      Sorry your Dad died and running the fruit farm has been such a hardship. Suck it up, Cry Baby! We all have troubles in life. Don’t air your personal trials here and expect it gives you credibility in a political discussion. Dead dad or not, farmer or not, your point about not having retirement argues for programs like pensions, 401Ks, and the like. Hopefully, someday you’ll be able to climb off that tractor and onto that rocking chair without having to sell the farm.

      1. Bill Steffen says:

        You are compassionless. Typical of the hot-dog-vendor hating racial bigots that you hang with: http://www.mlive.com/lansing-news/index.ssf/2012/12/lansing_business_owner_alleges.html

      2. big Daddy BC says:

        Oh, that’s rich. Now I hang with racists that attack hot dog vendors? You’re an idiot.

        1. Bill Steffen says:

          Quote by Nobel Prize Winner For Physics, Ivar Giaever: “I am a skeptic…Global warming has become a new religion.”

      3. Rob( Norton Shores) says:

        wow hatred…..you’ll go far in life….not!!!!

        1. Rob( Norton Shores) says:

          that was for big daddy

  19. Rob( Norton Shores) says:

    I’ll see you at Walmart big daddy.

    1. yooper4021 says:

      Rob – kudos to you and your business. Don’t let any of these guys get you down. We need more entrepreneurs like you to keep this economy humming. Keep up the good work!

  20. yooper4021 says:

    Wow. I’ve missed alot today. Glad to say that I was on the golf course this afternoon enjoying this great Michigan summer day!

    So after eading through the blog, here’s what I’ve learned:

    1) I should always blame the most convenient Republican for all of Michigan’s problems – Reagan, Bush 41, Engler, Bush 43, Snyder – even though a Democrat was also in a pretty important office at the same time (Blanchard, Clinton, Granholm, Obama).

    2) I should also blame the Republicans for all of my personal problems…especially the fact that I don’t have a pension.

    3) I should also blame the Republicans…..oh wait… I should give credit to the Democrats because the business I work for is booming and we are having a record year!

    4) The planet is baking….and I should give credit to the Democrats….oh shoot…I should blame the Republicans for that. Or maybe I should just give all the credit to Big Daddy and Travis for helping me see the light…..

    Geez….golfing was much more fun!

    1. yooper4021 says:

      oops…*reading* not *eading*…sorry.

    2. Paul says:

      Don’t worry yooper, just the normal from our resident manure spreader bdbc.

    3. big Daddy BC says:

      Was that a hint of sarcasm I detected in that clever post, yoop? Yes, it’s true. The republican party has hijacked Jesus, cares only about profit, and is the only thing standing between a strong middle class and ideological authoritarian rule.

        1. Robert(Plainwell) says:

          Only an idiot like you believes that nonsense.

        2. Bill Steffen says:

          Yeah, climate change IS growing the southern ice – IT’S GETTING COLDER!!! The Antarctic icecap has never had a greater extent on any August 21 than today: http://nsidc.org/data/seaice_index/images/daily_images/S_stddev_timeseries.png There’s a lot more ice than last year at this time and a lot more ice than average. The icecap has been growing steadily for over 25 years: http://arctic.atmos.uiuc.edu/cryosphere/IMAGES/seaice.anomaly.antarctic.png

          It’s gotten COLDER in Antarctica: http://www.john-daly.com/stations/amundsen.gif The sea surface temperatures are colder than average pretty much all around Antarctica: http://www.ospo.noaa.gov/data/sst/anomaly/2013/anomnight.8.19.2013.gif

  21. Jack says:

    Time for a Tune, by Melvin Taylor & The Slack Band…Depression Blues….CUE: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frGVkmRvPYg.

    1. yooper4021 says:

      Love your tunes Jack….thinking some of these folks need to take a deep breath and relax sometimes. Sheesh…

  22. yooper4021 says:

    Hey Big Daddy and Travis….now that we all know you’re global warming advocates and you’re obviously the experts on this blog about everything global warming…what is causing it and what would you suggest we do about it?

    1. Bill Steffen says:

      What’s causing it is a desire for money, fame and carbon-producing travel to warm, pleasant places where they can tell the story to a compliant press corps. Plus it advances an (anti-poor-and-middle class) agenda of “skyrocketing” utility rates, “European level” gasoline prices and carcinogen-filled light bulbs.

    2. big Daddy BC says:

      Bill, the poster child for the fringe right is now concerned with the middle class and poor people? LOL Here’s what happened to fuel costs under the last republican administration 2001-2009:


      Keep in mind that this was the biggest era of DEREGULATION in US history. It didn’t lower energy costs. It gave corporations the freedom to raise profits. I wonder, Bill, are you suggesting we should price-fix the utility companies because that sounds kind of socialist?

    3. Bill Steffen says:

      I am…and I think impartial readers know that. They know your character. I don’t have to lie like you did about Romney being a polygamist. When you come on here and comment, it gives me an opportunity to respond and share information that you and your “Use Mike’s Trick to Hide the Decline” co-conspirators would censor.

      Read this: http://www.forbes.com/sites/jamestaylor/2013/02/13/peer-reviewed-survey-finds-majority-of-scientists-skeptical-of-global-warming-crisis/

    4. big Daddy BC says:

      You post this crap regardless of who’s on here. You are a weatherman who’s drunk with his own celebrity. You lied when you said democrats were NAZIs. We’re not. We’re just sick of being kicked around by the wealthy. We’re sick of paying your taxes, cleaning up your messes, and listening to you claim to be moderate. You’re not. You’re on the far right fringe with a handful of religious zealots, billionaires, and trailer trash.

      1. Bill Steffen says:

        You lie when you say that I said democrats (did you mean to capitalize the “D”?) were Nazis. Nazis were socialists. The 2nd half of Hitler’s famous book, Mein Kampf was titled “The National Socialist Movement”. See for yourself: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mein_Kampf The 7 richest counties in the U.S. are the 7 counties surrounding Washington D.C. The Wealthy? http://online.wsj.com/article/SB124286642049341579.html

        Romney got 54% of the vote in Kent Co. and 67% in Ottawa Co. You’re far to the left the typical Obama voter. Remember over 700,000 people who voted for Obama voted AGAINST job-killing Proposal 2.

  23. kevin. w says:

    Sure glad I put my post up first so I don’t have to read all the Bellshut on this one, jeepers!

    1. Rocky (Rockford) says:

      +1 trillion!!!!!!!!!!!

  24. Cliff(Scotts) says:

    Glad I missed out on the fun today with Travis. I actually enjoyed today with this beautiful warm weather outside. Not glued to my computer screen like T-Pain being a keyboard warrior. Also enjoy knowing that Fixxxer likes to talk to himself on here with different aliases to himself. Hope everyone had a great day and enjoy the hot weather to come for the next week.

    1. Rocky (Rockford) says:

      +1 trillion!!

  25. Nathan (Forest Hills) says:

    I dont follow the news a lot obviously, but I do follow weather and global warming topics. And one thing is for sure, we shouldn’t be spending all of our money on global warming costs… I personally believe the money should help eliminate pollutants from the air, land, and water. And if we try to eliminate polluting, then the earth will technically stop warming (If you believe that pollutants and carbon dioxide are factors). So while we do spend money on trying to reduce carbon dioxide and gas emission into the atmosphere, it is also helping to reduce the amount of pollutants on Earth… And I believe that is very important for the future of our planet.

    1. Brian(Grandville) says:

      Nicely said Nathan, as well as exploring our own natural resources. Imagine the jobs that would create. If we were able to extract what we have under our feet (at least out west) there would be an economic boom, like nothing we have seen in our lifetime. This would also drive down the price of oil, not having to import it, which would lower the price at the pump. COMMON SENSE RIGHT GUYS ?

    2. big Daddy BC says:

      Common sense would favor renewable resources that also produce jobs in the way oil does. We needn’t continue extracting hydrocarbons for combustion thus producing the pollution Nathan was describing when wind and sun produce none.

      1. Bill Steffen says:

        Common sense would favor not burdening the poor and middle class with “skyrocketing” utility bills and $9 a gallon “European level” gasoline prices. Common sense would favor not forcing people to use carcinogen-filled light bulbs. Common sense would tell you that using a carcinogen-filled light bulb is not going to “save the planet” or budge global temperature a thousandths of a degree.

      2. big Daddy BC says:

        Bush raised your utility bills, not Clinton/Gore. And by the way, Tungsten is a carcinogen too. We’ve been using those bulbs for one hell of a long time.

        1. Bill Steffen says:

          Bush didn’t raise anyone’s bills. Gore would have been broke if he’d raised utility rates back then. This snopes article: http://www.snopes.com/politics/business/gorehome.asp said that back then, Gore’s monthly electric bill was $432. My first thought was that he was growing weed in the basement. Wonder if Uncle Sparkee could find that out! The article says that the Associated Press found that Gore was using 12 times the electricity of an average home in that area. Another TV station report said 20 times what a typical home in that (rich) area uses. That’s a heckuva carbon footprint.

          You don’t have to call HAZMAT when you break an incandescent bulb: http://www.maine.gov/dep/homeowner/cflbreakcleanup.html

  26. I shared this over on my facebook page: https://www.facebook.com/CharlesimagesStormedia/posts/540921309290347

    It is a WEDGE fire tornado that was recorded in Alaska. Absolutely amazing, and the most impressive fire tornado video that has ever been captured. Check it out!

    1. Bill Steffen says:

      Neat…the laws of physics are quite consistent.

  27. Skot says:

    Slow weather brings out the Trolls. Bill please change the pattern of dull weather and BIg Daddy and others just to drum up readership. Its Old and Boring. Enough is Enough.

  28. INDY says:


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